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Heavy base maps, and idea for stopping MASS infantry spams

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Heavy base maps, and idea for stopping MASS infantry spams

Postby airob » Tue Dec 15, 2009 6:19 pm

it´s a fact that maps with more than 3-4 bases tend to be really infantry heavy ones, to the point where you can´t even build your normal vehicle units beacuse those bases drain your funds, as you always follow the "build from every base!" law.

anyway this only occurs in the first 10-12 turns of the game, considering the map is big and it will take long and that it´s not adequatedly funded. then the income becomes stable along with the number of deployment facilities.

but these first turns are the ones that become annoying , even more if the map has narrow paths, or if it´s a right vs left, top vs bottom, corner vs corner symmetry.

so i thought of a way to stop this.
on any standard 2 pre-owned base map, you get an income of 3K(being 2 base+HQ) this turns out ok as the first 4-5 turns are inf spam and then you start building tanks and other vehicles, copter if there are airports available.

now come to think of a 5 pre-owned base map, you are getting an income of 6K, the 5 bases and HQ, you will deploy inf from every base each turn and until you´ve got at least quadruple the times those funds, you ain´t making too much stuff besides infantry.

it´s becasue the extra 1k makes the difference, come to think of it, why would the 2base map play nicely if it´s just in a smaller scale? it´s because this map starts with a 50% extra income from their base coundt, while the 5 base map starts with a 20% extra income.

so this infantry mass could be stopped if is made pre-owned for each 2 bases? like this:

2 bases+HQ
4base+HQ and a city
6bases+HQ and two cities

and so on..thogu not much maps would ever exceed 6 bases.
another good thing to do for this would be to use several fronts. and distributing them on with 1-2 bases each, and having a main front, putting in the main front the majority of cities available to capture and leaving the few rest on the secondary fronts, being these secondary fronts, much more close to the enemy, so they are forced to quickly deploy tanks and stuff. as well as high funds will be needed too, this last idea of the fronts adds to the map so it doesn´t feels so big and the fights start quickly

this is just a theory, seeing as there aren´t many base heavy maps, i would like to know what you would do to stop infantry mass spam on these type of maps, as i´m currently trying to prove my point in some test games(maps made by me)
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Postby Falkenwing » Tue Dec 15, 2009 7:36 pm

But then extra funds would lead to a vehicle rush around the first few turns, then when adequate funds are reached; the game will consist of many cheapvehicles, which disables the effect of infantry meatshields, because the AAs will bust right through them.
You should at least have a few infantries and mechs.
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Postby airob » Tue Dec 15, 2009 8:11 pm

Falkenwing wrote:But then extra funds would lead to a vehicle rush around the first few turns, then when adequate funds are reached; the game will consist of many cheapvehicles, which disables the effect of infantry meatshields, because the AAs will bust right through them.
You should at least have a few infantries and mechs.


for god´s sake have you even understood my point? say, a 6 pre-owned base map at which we would have a 9K income, according to my idea, comes that you are using 6K at least per turn!, leaving only the 3K to save, i seriously you have even read the whole thing i´ve written, and even if it becomes quite a tanks spam, well it´s supposed to be that way! 3 bases for vehicle and 3 bases for infantry!(taking in scale what would be a standar 2-3 base map)

tank spam you say? we are talking of a big map with multiple fronts, and as much as vehicles are spammed so will infantry be, and again, i don´t think you will be making a lot of AAs to rout infantry.
i´ve never said anything of completely nullifying infantry, it´s just that heavy base maps don´t increase on equal scales, the infantry scale just rises too much, so for it, the fund percentage must increase with it.
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Postby Falkenwing » Tue Dec 15, 2009 9:02 pm

Well tank spam usually has FTA on most maps.
ANd if you have that many funds, with airports, AAs will be built and will almost nullify infantries, unless those infantries are well protected from the tanks.
Though in non-air maps AAs probably won't be built much.
It's a good idea, but I'm worried about vehicle spam FTA.
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Postby funwes » Tue Dec 15, 2009 10:06 pm

Falkenwing wrote:AAs will be built and will almost nullify infantries.


This is a general strategy statement to show the error of this thinking. Not too much to do with the topic, but it needs to be said.

Scenario: The enemy is buying one tank and two infantry per day. You buy two infantry and an AA every 2-4 days and a tank the rest. Your AAs can only take out one infantry per day while the enemy pulls out two more. Then your enemy also has tanks to destroy your AAs that cost 1k more than his tanks. Your enemy gets a fund increase by killing your AAs while maintaining more territory with his infantry considering he'll just gain more infantry. Keep in mind that AAs will only OHKO infantry on zero star terrain. Maybe one star if you're lucky.

AAs are for their namesake; anti-air. Not for infantry countering.
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Postby Fungi127 » Tue Dec 15, 2009 11:52 pm

I like where you're coming from here, airob. I await in anticipation to see what you come up with.
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Re: Heavy base maps, and idea for stopping MASS infantry spa

Postby Ploumeur » Thu Dec 17, 2009 9:21 am

What about 2 pre-owned, 4-5 total bases by side maps?

For maps where there must be more pre-owned maps (mixed fronts, islands...) you can try to make a high-funds FTA counter of a "3K funds per 2 bases" map.

Then you start with some pre-owned cities. The first 4-5 turns must be almost infantry only, but the income increases sharply.
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Postby mrapex » Thu Dec 17, 2009 12:24 pm

here's the thing, no one wants to play on a 6 base map, period. There is just too much moving on the slow awbw server.

Also, your theory is good but I would suggest more funds because a 4 base map is not fine with just an hq. if they want to build a tank and no infantry on the first turn then let them. they will loose. i think 7k for 4 bases starting might be ok.
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Re: Heavy base maps, and idea for stopping MASS infantry spa

Postby airob » Thu Dec 17, 2009 2:03 pm

Ploumeur wrote:What about 2 pre-owned, 4-5 total bases by side maps?

For maps where there must be more pre-owned maps (mixed fronts, islands...) you can try to make a high-funds FTA counter of a "3K funds per 2 bases" map.

Then you start with some pre-owned cities. The first 4-5 turns must be almost infantry only, but the income increases sharply.


i agree with you here, and i think i never said that tanks should be built day 1-5, if you notice on most heavy base mapsthe first tank is built near turn 8-9 which on 2-3 base maps they are built day 5-6

btw the point of all this is NOT that you build a tank early,it´s the POSSIBILITY of doing so on early turns(5-6-7) you can keep building infantry if you want, but what happens most of them time is that the bases drain 1K each for infantry being 4-5bases= -4K,5K. to the 9-11Kyou´ll have by day 6-7

EDIT: by tank i don´t mean a TANK exactly, i refer to any +5K unit

EDIT2: ok i have a lot of ideas and points i want to explain, however i don´t want anyone misundestanding my sucky english, so i will explain myself further once i get some screen shots, proof and other test results to help myself. :?
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walkerboh on PM: Also it isn't a tag game either. Were you
drunk when you made this? haha

<@FCK> I just used scissors on some ass till they bled had just now
<@FCK> *hard

<Fanboy> doood
<airob> ?
<Fanboy> r u trying to seduce me O_O

<Walker> at least fdk only fucks with me

<Mr--Clean> well theres a new country
<Mr--Clean> called bare flesh
<Walker> Sounds hot. The HQ is probably a dick
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